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Post by three5 on Feb 27, 2023 17:27:42 GMT
Philip, I've never managed to find out what "the inherent weakness of the 2AD of that period" is. Do you, or perhaps Charlie, have any details of what the weakness is? I'm running one of these engines and have done for 105k miles. I believe that Davrav has done a lot more miles than this without problem. Mine has had it's oil changed ( 10w - 30 ) twice a year since new ( I think that the advice came from Anchorman originally ).
Chris there is a link to the thread I wrote many years back that will give you the nuts and bolts …. The actual cause according to one of the technicians that set up a Toyota specialist garage in Worcester was the extremely restrictive EGR valve….. Im no longer a fan of that technician because he did a bad turn to one of our esteemed members and then rubbed me up the wrong way but the fella really knows his stuff as does his business partner as they were both master technicians at Worcester Toyota. The one thing owners can do to help prevent the build up of carbon and other nasties is to use quality diesel and as David mentions above an additive like the Archoil David uses. Plus it’s a good idea to use the correct Low ash or low SAPS oil. As I mentioned above there is no rhyme or reason why some engines go for big mileages and others pop early. It’s a fair deduction to make that says engines in cars that do short trips get fed supermarket pish ( As Kev calls it ) and get filled with cheap oil are at the most risk. Interesting Charlie, I take my EGR valve off and clean it every 18 months ( 10k Miles? ). Wonder if that makes a difference? |
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Post by charliefarlie on Feb 27, 2023 17:32:27 GMT
145K and change at the moment.......... Still using Archoil 6900-DMax. Put a dose in this morning before a fill up as it happens. Does seem to increase mpg by a couple of miles/gallon and engine is considerably quieter. I should have said David, I use Millers Diesel+ with every tankful and have done since it was new. That alone may be why your engine is so healthy. It like David’s has been treated right. As far as I’m aware none of the 4.4 cars have been affected. Very likely…. Almost certainly because of the totally revised EGR valves … I’ve never once used cheap diesel in my 4.4 and have always put either Millers or Archoil in the tank. I don’t do short journeys either. |
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Post by philip42h on Feb 27, 2023 17:33:45 GMT
So, the question is, what should our new friend Crofter do now? (Note that this is not the original Crofter) If the engine has succumbed to the inherent weakness of the 2AD of that period it would need a new 3/4 engine / competent engine rebuild - and that would almost certainly cost more than the car is worth. So probably best to write the car off as beyond economic repair? But there exists the possibility, albeit perhaps a rather small one, that this is just a failure of the head gasket. In which case it could be competently repaired. As I understand from lurking and reading around the head can be skimmed if necessary but the repair must then use an appropriately thicker head gasket to maintain clearance between the valves and pistons! Such gaskets are available. There is no guarantee that such a repair will last ... I'm in absolutely no position to advise which of these two options is more appropriate in this case ... Philip, I've never managed to find out what "the inherent weakness of the 2AD of that period" is. Do you, or perhaps Charlie, have any details of what the weakness is? I'm running one of these engines and have done for 105k miles. I believe that Davrav has done a lot more miles than this without problem. Mine has had it's oil changed ( 10w - 30 ) twice a year since new ( I think that the advice came from Anchorman originally ).
Charlie did a write-up of the original issue - after his T180 'enjoyed' it. In the 'other' place it's: Charliefarlies Guide To The Toyota 2Ad Diesel Engine And Its Issues. and there's a copy here at forum.rav4driversclub.com/thread/69/charliefarlies-guide-diesel-series-engine as Charlie posted above. Toyota offered a goodwill 7 year warranty on the affected engines which were "RAV4 with 2AD (Prod. Date: Jul 2005 to Dec 2008)". Reputedly the issue was "resolved in production from 2008" but there is a growing number of cases of very similar sounding issues with later versions of the 2AD engine so who knows. To be fair to Toyota, the actual proportion of engines affected is/was relatively low and Toyota did offer a ¾ engine replacement under the goodwill warranty. That is long past, of course and as these engines get older they are more likely to fail for some reason or other ... |
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Post by charliefarlie on Feb 27, 2023 17:36:27 GMT
Chris there is a link to the thread I wrote many years back that will give you the nuts and bolts …. The actual cause according to one of the technicians that set up a Toyota specialist garage in Worcester was the extremely restrictive EGR valve….. Im no longer a fan of that technician because he did a bad turn to one of our esteemed members and then rubbed me up the wrong way but the fella really knows his stuff as does his business partner as they were both master technicians at Worcester Toyota. The one thing owners can do to help prevent the build up of carbon and other nasties is to use quality diesel and as David mentions above an additive like the Archoil David uses. Plus it’s a good idea to use the correct Low ash or low SAPS oil. As I mentioned above there is no rhyme or reason why some engines go for big mileages and others pop early. It’s a fair deduction to make that says engines in cars that do short trips get fed supermarket pish ( As Kev calls it ) and get filled with cheap oil are at the most risk. Interesting Charlie, I take my EGR valve off and clean it every 18 months ( 10k Miles? ). Wonder if that makes a difference? I feel slightly embarrassed that I didn’t recommend cleaning the EGR earlier in this thread. I made up a pipe that had a tube taped into the end that was attached to my Henry vacuum so when cleaning the EGR virtually all of the muck went up the hoover and not down into the combustion chamber. I still have that pipe in the garage to this day 👍👍 |
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Post by Mb2t on Feb 27, 2023 17:40:23 GMT
My previous Avensis (2.2D, which i believe is the same engine) did 180k miles with no issue, though it did mostly long motorway miles, and was never fed supermarket pish (also not the expensive liqueur...).
Did Toyota fix only engines that developed the issue or you could say 'my engine is at risk, fix it please'?
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Post by philip42h on Feb 27, 2023 17:54:14 GMT
So, the question is, what should our new friend Crofter do now? (Note that this is not the original Crofter) If the engine has succumbed to the inherent weakness of the 2AD of that period it would need a new 3/4 engine / competent engine rebuild - and that would almost certainly cost more than the car is worth. So probably best to write the car off as beyond economic repair? But there exists the possibility, albeit perhaps a rather small one, that this is just a failure of the head gasket. In which case it could be competently repaired. As I understand from lurking and reading around the head can be skimmed if necessary but the repair must then use an appropriately thicker head gasket to maintain clearance between the valves and pistons! Such gaskets are available. There is no guarantee that such a repair will last ... I'm in absolutely no position to advise which of these two options is more appropriate in this case ... Bear in mind it’s around 10 or more years since I wrote the guide I linked to above. It was originally written when a lot of us were members on the other forum. So I may not get things 100% correct. Firstly it’s extremely likely to be the old issues that have never gone away, No one can say 100% I guess until they have the engine apart. If it is the common issue it’s fair to say it’s an uneconomical repair. Just a simple head gasket no problem but Toyota didn’t supply and fit re manufactured engines if a head gasket would cure it. My understanding is the head cannot be skimmed. I’m not 100% sure because there is much conflicting info out there. Even if it can the rest of the engine would likely cause another failure. That’s based on the long arduous history regarding this subject. Very sad to say there are no positive answers. It was always going happen as there is no rhyme or reason as to when failures would or could occur. I can’t remember when the good will warranty expired but still these occurrences appear far to often. I thought crofter was an old member from TOC and was also on here some time back. 👍👍 As to whether or not the head can be skimmed ... as I understand it, if you skim the head and use a standard replacement head gasket there is a very decent chance of a subsequent 'collision' between the pistons and the values (which would be bad) - hence the body of opinion that the head cannot be skimmed. But one can get head gaskets that are thicker than the standard for use in such circumstances to maintain the separation between pistons and valves and thus allowing for a successful skim and head gasket replacement. The gaskets come in a range of thicknesses from 0.9mm to 1.2mm, so I'm 99% sure that the job could be done (but I could also be wrong!  ) As I said before, I've no idea whether such a repair would be worthwhile ... Crofter (Dell) was an old member from the TOC - he passed away in 2019 as notified by his son at that time ... |
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Post by philip42h on Feb 27, 2023 17:56:13 GMT
My previous Avensis (2.2D, which i believe is the same engine) did 180k miles with no issue, though it did mostly long motorway miles, and was never fed supermarket pish (also not the expensive liqueur...). Did Toyota fix only engines that developed the issue or you could say 'my engine is at risk, fix it please'? Toyota fixed the engines that showed proven evidence of the issue ... as described in the most excellent write-up ...  |
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Post by charliefarlie on Feb 27, 2023 18:09:39 GMT
My previous Avensis (2.2D, which i believe is the same engine) did 180k miles with no issue, though it did mostly long motorway miles, and was never fed supermarket pish (also not the expensive liqueur...). Did Toyota fix only engines that developed the issue or you could say 'my engine is at risk, fix it please'? As per the guide engines burning oil over a certain level were replaced without any problems. Plus of course any displaying head gasket issues. The same engine was used in the following �Avensis with 1AD or 2AD (Prod. Date: Apr 2005 to Feb 2009) ��RAV4 with 2AD (Prod. Date: Jul 2005 to Dec 2008) ��Auris with 1AD or 2AD (Prod. Date: Sep 2006 to Sep 2009) ��Verso with 2AD (Prod. Date: Apr 2005 to Nov 2008) But after that list was compiled Toyota started replacing engines in the later cars fitted with the 2AD engine as they also started to have the same problems. |
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Post by davrav on Feb 27, 2023 18:11:11 GMT
Have only cleaned the EGR once - about ten years ago........
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Post by three5 on Feb 27, 2023 21:21:32 GMT
Interesting Charlie, I take my EGR valve off and clean it every 18 months ( 10k Miles? ). Wonder if that makes a difference? I feel slightly embarrassed that I didn’t recommend cleaning the EGR earlier in this thread. I made up a pipe that had a tube taped into the end that was attached to my Henry vacuum so when cleaning the EGR virtually all of the muck went up the hoover and not down into the combustion chamber. I still have that pipe in the garage to this day 👍👍 Good grief Charlie! That's exactly what I do - and with a Henry as well! |
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Post by charliefarlie on Feb 28, 2023 9:23:29 GMT
I feel slightly embarrassed that I didn’t recommend cleaning the EGR earlier in this thread. I made up a pipe that had a tube taped into the end that was attached to my Henry vacuum so when cleaning the EGR virtually all of the muck went up the hoover and not down into the combustion chamber. I still have that pipe in the garage to this day 👍👍 Good grief Charlie! That's exactly what I do - and with a Henry as well! No other vacuum comes close to a Henry for the car. Especially a RAV4 🤪🤪 |
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Post by davrav on Feb 28, 2023 9:44:35 GMT
Good grief Charlie! That's exactly what I do - and with a Henry as well! No other vacuum comes close to a Henry for the car. Especially a RAV4 🤪🤪 Henry needs to be careful - lot of sharks out there  |
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Post by battleaxe1 on Mar 22, 2023 9:09:42 GMT
Hi been a while but here again, my 4-3 had the engine change at 21000, now on 99034, I blanked the EGR of then, put 150 mm of two stroke oil in 30lts of fuel, in my eyes any one who puts ext gas into the cylinder asking for trouble, regardless of emissions, change oil twice a year, I know this isn't helping folk who's heads have gone, just my thought on the subject
Battleaxe aka geordie
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Post by three5 on Mar 22, 2023 9:24:24 GMT
Hi been a while but here again, my 4-3 had the engine change at 21000, now on 99034, I blanked the EGR of then, put 150 mm of two stroke oil in 30lts of fuel, in my eyes any one who puts ext gas into the cylinder asking for trouble, regardless of emissions, change oil twice a year, I know this isn't helping folk who's heads have gone, just my thought on the subject Battleaxe aka geordie I'm in the same position, engine changed by Toyota at 32,000 miles. I use Millers additive with every fill of fuel ( non-supermarket ) and have done since day one. I change the oil every 6 months and clean the EGR about every 18 months. The car has now done 105,000 and I have never had to top up the oil since the new engine was fitted. The engine replacement was done because of excessive oil consumption. I can still get low 50's MPG on a journey of more than about 50 miles. However, because I do a lot of short journeys these days, I'm thinking about Yaris X, more about that, probably next week.
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Post by firemac on Mar 22, 2023 10:08:26 GMT
Hi been a while but here again, my 4-3 had the engine change at 21000, now on 99034, I blanked the EGR of then, put 150 mm of two stroke oil in 30lts of fuel, in my eyes any one who puts ext gas into the cylinder asking for trouble, regardless of emissions, change oil twice a year, I know this isn't helping folk who's heads have gone, just my thought on the subject Battleaxe aka geordie I'm in the same position, engine changed by Toyota at 32,000 miles. I use Millers additive with every fill of fuel ( non-supermarket ) and have done since day one. I change the oil every 6 months and clean the EGR about every 18 months. The car has now done 105,000 and I have never had to top up the oil since the new engine was fitted. The engine replacement was done because of excessive oil consumption. I can still get low 50's MPG on a journey of more than about 50 miles. However, because I do a lot of short journeys these days, I'm thinking about Yaris X, more about that, probably next week.
I like the Yaris X. To me it looks like a smaller RAV and I have been tempted to replace the 4.5 with one……🤔 |
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