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Post by unclebob on Dec 12, 2021 21:20:11 GMT
Read on one of the F1 forum ..Mercedes appeals rejected !….roll on 2022 .
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Post by davidwilson on Dec 12, 2021 21:26:15 GMT
Read on one of the F1 forum ..Mercedes appeals rejected !….roll on 2022 . Yes but they can appeal as Philip has said. Then they can go to Sports Arbitration! Personally I think it would be better for Mercedes to concentrate on next year. Mercedes would be better celebrating winning the constructors championship in my opinion.
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Post by charliefarlie on Dec 12, 2021 21:32:19 GMT
Read on one of the F1 forum ..Mercedes appeals rejected !….roll on 2022 . Yes but they can appeal as Philip has said. Then they can go to Sports Arbitration! Personally I think it would be better for Mercedes to concentrate on next year. Mercedes would be better celebrating winning the constructors championship in my opinion. Completely agree….. 👍👍👍
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Post by widge on Dec 12, 2021 22:26:19 GMT
Shame about how the race ended causing arguments about rules regulations etc, I think that ths Marshalls were in a no win situation and what ever they did was going to be wrong for somebody, the last thing anybody realy wanted is the championship to be finished under a safety car, but there was not enough time to safely allow all the backmarkers through which would have been the normal procedure in a dry race, but not clearing the backmarkers would have been just as bad with the chaos of so many cars being blue flagged
It is a shame that the accident wasn't a few laps earlier giving enough time to clear the backmarkers, even better if Hamilton also had enough time to change onto softs then we might have got a couple of realy exciting last laps to finish of the season.
Still looking forward to next year with George as Hamiltons team-mate if the last time he drove a Mercedes is anything to go by, Hamilton may have a good challenge from within the team as well as from the red bulls.
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Post by widge on Dec 12, 2021 22:41:43 GMT
I thought under a safety car the drivers had to keep the same distances apart until a re start. One driver in particular had managed a gap of something like 8 seconds all of which was lost when the re start got started. I’ve not taken a huge interest in F1 until the two main protagonists started the battle royal this year so I’m out of touch. The driver who effectively had his 8 second lead could be said to have been robbed. I would agree with that. But both drivers have. / had things to belly ache about…. As the very good Sky commentary team said “ Both deserve to win but it doesent happen that way “ Nuff said No , with a virtual safety car that's the case but with an actual safety car they all bunch up. Until they started to use the virtual safety car it was always the case that cars would bunch up under a safety car, the virtual safety car was brought in to try to reduce that, but the safety car is still used if the accident/breakdown is in a dangerous place or if the Marshalls have to go onto the track to remove debris.
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Post by jasehutch on Dec 13, 2021 6:29:43 GMT
I wouldn't be surprised to see Lewis announce his retirement..
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Post by unclebob on Dec 13, 2021 9:09:54 GMT
I wouldn't be surprised to see Lewis announce his retirement.. Lewis’s wages for 2021 was around 22 million plus bonuses…..I’m sure he’ll get over this year’s championship outcome 😉
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Post by charliefarlie on Dec 13, 2021 9:16:18 GMT
I wouldn't be surprised to see Lewis announce his retirement.. No chance….. He might after winning the 8th title but not now. Just can’t see it…
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Post by firemac on Dec 13, 2021 10:40:18 GMT
I don’t really follow F1 anymore so I’m not up on it now like I once was, but I have kept abreast of the Hammy/Maxi saga over the past few months. I read in one of the papers this morning that one of the options that Masi had was to red flag the race and then re-start from the grid; that way everyone could have changed tyres and started on an equal footing. To my mind it would have been a fairer outcome especially in the final race which was the title decider. To my mind, what Masi did resulted in a fabricated end to the championship.
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Post by philip42h on Dec 13, 2021 11:31:11 GMT
I don’t really follow F1 anymore so I’m not up on it now like I once was, but I have kept abreast of the Hammy/Maxi saga over the past few months. I read in one of the papers this morning that one of the options that Masi had was to red flag the race and then re-start from the grid; that way everyone could have changed tyres and started on an equal footing. To my mind it would have been a fairer outcome especially in the final race which was the title decider. To my mind, what Masi did resulted in a fabricated end to the championship. I'm nowhere near sure, but I suspect that if they had red flagged the race there wouldn't have been an opportunity to restart - too much of the race distance had already been covered? And that would have handed the title to Hamilton, which, given the lead he had built up by that time wouldn't have been desperately unfair. Alternatively, and reasonably, they could have deployed the safety car as they did to clear away the wreckage. Red Bull were quite within their rights to come into the pits - ceding track position for a more competitive car. And once the track was clear, they could have resumed the race at the earliest opportunity. Giving Max a probably a couple of laps in which to get the job done but an additional five cars to pass under blue flags in the process. That would have given Max a fighting chance, but also given Lewis a break. What they did was manoeuvre the five lapped cars out of the way, thereby reducing Lewis lead to zero (and even less than that as Max was getting over eager but that is of precisely no matter). This left Lewis with little more than a snowflakes chance, and, as you say, fabricated the end to the championship. That said, neither team did anything desperately 'wrong' during the race - Red Bull were tactically more aggressive; Mercedes were tactically more conservative - and, bar the 'fix' at the end the race would have shown that once again the Mercedes was the faster car on that circuit. As folk have already noted, Mercedes have won the Constructors title, again, demonstrating that they do have the fastest car across the season as a whole. And that is really the point of Formula 1 - to build and race the fastest car within the rules laid down by the formula. But for the viewer, it is very pleasing to note that the gap to Red Bull is now really quite small and there are other teams showing definite progress - which bodes well for future seasons. And the 'fix' handed the Drivers title to arguably the fastest driver on the circuit this season. One may or may not like / approve of Max's racing style but he is certainly quick and gets the best out of the car he has. And, to that extent, the result is OK ... F1 will never should who is really the best driver since, by definition, they don't compete on an equal footing. Lewis has won several titles by being the better driver in a Mercedes - he may, or may not, have been the best driver across all competitors. But for the fans, and the teams, the FIA need to sort out a set of relatively clear and unambiguous rules that result in fair racing and that allow the best team to win. If they want more mayhem, they could always skip qualifying in favour of a reverse grid start - championship leader starts at the back etc. But that would be a very different sport!
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Post by unclebob on Dec 13, 2021 11:32:54 GMT
I don’t really follow F1 anymore so I’m not up on it now like I once was, but I have kept abreast of the Hammy/Maxi saga over the past few months. I read in one of the papers this morning that one of the options that Masi had was to red flag the race and then re-start from the grid; that way everyone could have changed tyres and started on an equal footing. To my mind it would have been a fairer outcome especially in the final race which was the title decider. To my mind, what Masi did resulted in a fabricated end to the championship. I’m sure Michael Masi was a quick replacement after the sudden dead of Charlie Whiting, maybe the FIA need to rethink who has the race directors job.
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Post by clarki on Dec 13, 2021 12:04:33 GMT
Great season - follow that 2022!!
I'm fairly neutral between the 2 drivers but I think Max deserved it. He's been the only driver having a go at Hamilton for years and was the quicker this year.
Not really one for stats me - IMO Jim Clark is the GOAT - but Hamilton will be back for No 8, and there's a bit of me that hopes he gets it. Lets see...
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Post by unclebob on Dec 13, 2021 13:02:53 GMT
Let’s be honest it brought some excitement to the season 👏🏻👏🏻 Maybe next year with the new car regulations, there could be 4 or 5 team fighting for the championship ….yes …ok wishful thinking 😉😉
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Post by widge on Dec 13, 2021 13:32:58 GMT
I don’t really follow F1 anymore so I’m not up on it now like I once was, but I have kept abreast of the Hammy/Maxi saga over the past few months. I read in one of the papers this morning that one of the options that Masi had was to red flag the race and then re-start from the grid; that way everyone could have changed tyres and started on an equal footing. To my mind it would have been a fairer outcome especially in the final race which was the title decider. To my mind, what Masi did resulted in a fabricated end to the championship. My feeling is that might have been a better solution as a spectator,but hindsight is a wonderful thing. in the race they were obviously hoping that they could clear the track and resume the race in good time, red flags are usually only used if it is not safe to circuit the track due to major debris or weather conditions, I don't know but they might have also been breaking the rules by stopping the race without due cause.
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Post by Hoovie on Dec 13, 2021 15:06:29 GMT
I don’t really follow F1 anymore so I’m not up on it now like I once was, but I have kept abreast of the Hammy/Maxi saga over the past few months. I read in one of the papers this morning that one of the options that Masi had was to red flag the race and then re-start from the grid; that way everyone could have changed tyres and started on an equal footing. To my mind it would have been a fairer outcome especially in the final race which was the title decider. To my mind, what Masi did resulted in a fabricated end to the championship. I'm nowhere near sure, but I suspect that if they had red flagged the race there wouldn't have been an opportunity to restart - too much of the race distance had already been covered? And that would have handed the title to Hamilton, which, given the lead he had built up by that time wouldn't have been desperately unfair. Alternatively, and reasonably, they could have deployed the safety car as they did to clear away the wreckage. Red Bull were quite within their rights to come into the pits - ceding track position for a more competitive car. And once the track was clear, they could have resumed the race at the earliest opportunity. Giving Max a probably a couple of laps in which to get the job done but an additional five cars to pass under blue flags in the process. That would have given Max a fighting chance, but also given Lewis a break. What they did was manoeuvre the five lapped cars out of the way, thereby reducing Lewis lead to zero (and even less than that as Max was getting over eager but that is of precisely no matter). This left Lewis with little more than a snowflakes chance, and, as you say, fabricated the end to the championship. That said, neither team did anything desperately 'wrong' during the race - Red Bull were tactically more aggressive; Mercedes were tactically more conservative - and, bar the 'fix' at the end the race would have shown that once again the Mercedes was the faster car on that circuit. As folk have already noted, Mercedes have won the Constructors title, again, demonstrating that they do have the fastest car across the season as a whole. And that is really the point of Formula 1 - to build and race the fastest car within the rules laid down by the formula. But for the viewer, it is very pleasing to note that the gap to Red Bull is now really quite small and there are other teams showing definite progress - which bodes well for future seasons. And the 'fix' handed the Drivers title to arguably the fastest driver on the circuit this season. One may or may not like / approve of Max's racing style but he is certainly quick and gets the best out of the car he has. And, to that extent, the result is OK ... F1 will never should who is really the best driver since, by definition, they don't compete on an equal footing. Lewis has won several titles by being the better driver in a Mercedes - he may, or may not, have been the best driver across all competitors. But for the fans, and the teams, the FIA need to sort out a set of relatively clear and unambiguous rules that result in fair racing and that allow the best team to win. If they want more mayhem, they could always skip qualifying in favour of a reverse grid start - championship leader starts at the back etc. But that would be a very different sport! A Red flag would not have prevented the race from restarting at all. There is no rule that states you cannot restart the race again and complete the allocated number of laps.
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